# Multimedia 

Multimedia 

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Cato Weekly Podcast • January 10, 2023 

# As Unions Decline, They Get Creative 

Courts have given public sector employees the ability to walk away from their unions, so unions have had to get creative in retaining those members. Ken Girardin of the Empire Center discusses the state of unions today.

[![Creative Commons License](/build/cato_2020/images/creative-commons.svg)](http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/) 
This work is licensed under a [Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial-ShareAlike 4.0 International License](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/4.0/). 

##### Featuring 

##### Ken Girardin 

Fellow, Empire Center

[![Square face shot of Caleb O. Brown.](/sites/cato.org/files/styles/author_picture/public/2021-01/cbrown_sq.jpg?itok=zSWLm8kR)](/people/caleb-o-brown) 

##### [Caleb O. Brown](/people/caleb-o-brown)

Former Director of Multimedia, Host and Executive Producer, *Cato Daily Podcast*, Cato Institute